Make Your Story Shine: Tips for Revising Your Manuscript
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Rebecca King: Welcome, you’re listening to a 2021 WriteOnCon podcast. This is Rebecca King from the WriteOnCon team, and I am on the edge of my seat excited to be here today with Liselle Sambury to discuss tips for polishing your manuscript. Liselle, thank you for joining me.
Liselle Sambury: Thanks for having me.
Rebecca King: For those of you who may not know, Liselle is a debut author who earned a two-book deal with her soon to be released Blood Like Magic, a dark urban fantasy following a teen witch who was given a horrifying task: sacrificing her first love to save her family’s magic. You can’t get it yet, so add this one to Goodreads for June. Liselle, for all us writers who are sitting with our first drafts and our red pencils, how important is revision to the writing process?
I think revision is so huge in the writing process. I won’t say it’s the most important step because I do think the most important step is having your book written—because you can’t revise anything if you have nothing—but revision is really what helps polish up your book to help you achieve those goals. Whether you’re wanting to pursue traditional publishing or if you’re wanting to self-publish, you need to revise, because I don’t think I know a single person that does a first draft that’s just perfect.
You really need that time to make it better and to make it the best it can be. And so I think revision is huge and can really take your book from something really rough that you maybe didn’t even like that much to something you absolutely love and are super proud of. And so I think it’s so paramount to the process.
Rebecca King: So can you talk about the different levels of polishing that happen? And I’ve heard of developmental edits, I’ve heard of line edits; any other types of edits that we should be aware of, that sort of thing?
Liselle Sambury: Those are the ones I know, so: developmental, and then your line edits, and then if you’re in the traditionally published process eventually you’ll do things like copy edits and past pages. But when you’re revising on your own, it’s pretty much divided into big picture edits, like at our developmental, and then smaller line level ones that you’re doing later on in the process.
I think definitely after your first draft you’re going to end up doing developmental, you’re probably going to have to move things around, and for me developmental is kind of broken down into a few parts. So it’s things like structural: so if, you know, your middle’s too long, or your first act is too short, things like that that you have to move around. It’s things like pacing: so parts of the book that you think are maybe too slow or boring or drag, or parts that are way too fast, that happened without being able to get into the meat of the story that need to be slowed down. And then character: so your character arcs, if there’s something going on with the character, their arc doesn’t quite make sense. So they achieve their goal at the end, and they do whatever it is they need to do—they slay the dragon, let’s say—but then you’re not sure if it made sense that they did it that quickly, or you’re not sure if it’s satisfying for the reader.
And so, those are the chunks I would say go into developmental: that character, that pacing, and that structure. Versus a line level which is things like, you know, making it pretty—like fixing up your little lines to make them flow nicer adding metaphors to make things a little bit nicer to read; and fixing up your grammar and that sort of thing. And that’s really the line level, I would say.
Rebecca King: So then, when we’re originally drafting, that sort of gives us a little latitude. So I could just go through and write what I intend to say, knowing that I’m going to come back to it later and refine it and really add in the pretty words, make it flow better. That’s an okay process for somebody to have then?
Liselle Sambury: Yeah, I think, for me personally—I know some people really are—they get really hooked on wanting to draft clean. They want the first draft to be as perfect as humanly possible. I always think it’s better to draft rough and fix it later for me, because I plot out my books—I think if you can get at least a base structure, so you know what’s going to happen at the beginning, middle and end, so you kind of have a bit of a roadmap to follow. Even if you are a pantser-style writer, meaning that you don’t like to plan before you hop in, I think there’s a lot of benefit to at least having a bit of a skeleton plan so that you’re not having to do as many structural edits later on. Because I think that’s what can be really daunting in the editing process is if your structure is off, and then you have to do these huge rewrites to fix your structure.
And so I think having that in place when you draft can be really helpful—but I am a big proponent of letting your draft be rough and not getting caught up in having things that are perfect or having perfect lines. When I’m doing my rough drafts, I don’t often get in nice lines. I’ve kind of just getting the story out however I can. Because I know that when I go and revise, that’s the time when I can do all of that, and once I revise and I get those big picture things done—the developmental things down—then I can go back and I can make everything extra pretty, and I can put in all my metaphors and my fun things. And I can get that out, you know, and whatever you couldn’t get in the drafting process, you can get later in the revision process, and so I think that’s the big part of it; like, that’s why I say revising can help you do that polish and make the story something you really really love. But again, you can’t revise something you don’t have.
And I just find that, you know, when you’re newer into getting into writing and you’re trying to finish your first novel that can be the most daunting thing is that you hold yourself back from finishing the book, because you’re so concerned about getting it perfect. But drafting is not for getting the book perfect. And really, you know, perfect is very subjective. But revising can help me get it to as perfect as it can be for you and for you to be happy with the project.
Rebecca King: Yeah! And to your point, I got myself into a situation where I was—I was writing for a reading group that met every week. And so I did exactly what you’re saying not to do: it was all pretty words, but at the end I had none of the correct structure or anything, because I was just writing towards satisfying that weekly group, not towards writing the overall story. So I think that’s phenomenal guidance: to focus on just getting a draft down and then looking at the overall issues before you start doing those line edits.
And so if the process of writing a book is basically step one, develop the concept; step two, draft it; and then step three, revising—and I realize that those are three huge things that people do in different ways—but talk to us a little bit about how much time you dedicate to each, and how that’s changed since you sold your first book, if at all. I mean, maybe you still use the same process—but if that’s evolved over time for you.
Liselle Sambury: For me, it definitely has evolved over time because when I wrote the very first book I wrote, I pantsed it, so I did zero, truly zero, planning. I just sat down and I wrote it. And so the concept stage, wasn’t that long because I didn’t do any planning. To me part of the concept stage is, if you’re a plotter—and even if you’re not a plotter and you just want some skeleton notes to know where you’re going—to me that’s part of the concept stage.
It’s like thinking of the idea, but also planning what you’re going to do before you start drafting, and when I first started writing I did very little of that planning. And then I spent a chunk of time doing the drafting (it was very on and off) so I guess I would have spent, yeah, almost zero time on concept. I spent a lot of time drafting, getting that first draft done, because it was that same thing that I talked about, like when you’re a newer writer and you’re so obsessed with getting everything perfect. I think I rewrote my chapter, my first chapter about five times before I actually got around to writing the rest of the book. And so that took, I wanna say, like a year or two to get the drafting done.
And then I did very little revision because to me revising your book was only line edits. It was fixing your grammar, it was making sure your sentences were clean, and then that was it, you were done, and then you could send it off to people. So my concept and my revising times were very short and my drafting time was much longer. And that’s changed immensely over my writing career.
Now, I spend a good chunk of time on concept and plotting, so I’ll usually spend—before, I spent like a week or two on plotting. That’s about as much time as I spent plotting Blood Like Magic. Now with future books, I do a longer, a much longer plotting session. So I take something closer to two to four weeks, just so I can really, really plan and nail down everything. And it depends on stories, too. For example, if you have fantasy or sci fi stories, you’re probably gonna spend a lot more time with the concept, because there’s a lot more that you have to do, versus if you’re doing something that’s kind of, you know, based on the real world—or, for me, I also write horror, so in that case, it’s a little bit less concept time because I’m not really working with having to build a magic system in the same way. It’s a lot softer of a magic system and so I don’t need all those rules, so I can take a bit of a shorter time. But yeah, about two to four weeks.
In the drafting, I fast draft because I like to be done with it. And so it takes me usually a maximum of two months to draft a project. I work really quickly with it, and part of that is because I know that the bulk of my work is going to be in revision. And so it’s more beneficial for me to just get the project drafted and to get that ready. And it also is a function of the planning time, so that two to four weeks that I spent planning means that I know everything that I’m going to write. And so when I get to the actual drafting process it’s faster in that way, because I already know exactly what’s going to go down on the page—I just need to get it down there. And I’m not trying to make it super pretty because I know that’s the thing I’m going to do in revision.
And so my revision process is significantly, significantly longer. I could easily spend a year revising a project on and off. It’s a little bit shorter now that I’m getting books traditionally published, of course—I have deadlines to hit, and so I can’t spend forever revising. But I will always spend most of my time during the writing process on revisions, because that’s really where I’m doing the bulk of the changes. And I have found that the more time I add to the concepting and plotting stage, the less time I spend in the revision stage, because the biggest part of revisions are those developmental: those structural, those pacing, those characters. And when I’ve planned all of those in advance, it makes it a lot easier to revise, because then those things are in place and I’m not spending as much time fixing that.
Whereas, you know, when I started as a writer in the beginning, I was spending a lot in those in-between stage[s], in between me doing no revising and doing a lot more revising. I had to spend a lot more time on that. Blood Like Magic, I rewrote half of the book twice because I had to fix structural things and get that right and then later on I could move on to those character things—I ended up cutting one of my characters as well. And so, to me, the revision process is definitely the longest part of the process.
Rebecca King: Yeah, that’s tough, adding a character or taking one out, that can be really tough. That’s interesting though—you must have had a pretty clean draft still, I mean I’ve heard people say oh yeah I revise six or seven times from beginning to end. So, you’ve got to have a lot of that story sense in your head already to have gotten yourself that close.
So how does a new writer know what to revise, like if they don’t yet have a story sense? We all know how to read a story and know, “oh, that’s a good story,” but it’s not the same when we go to write one. So, do you have any recommendations about how you gain the knowledge about what needs to be revised?
Liselle Sambury: I think there’s kind of two parts to this that really helped me along when I was learning to revise and self-edit was, for one, looking at writing craft books and really learning because I just find that every time I read a writing craft book, I think “ah, I haven’t done that in my book” or “this would be really cool if I did this in my book” and it ends up jogging ideas for things that I can revise and it just ends up helping a lot. And then the other side of that is critique partners and beta readers. To me that’s the most invaluable part because sometimes I get to the point in editing a book and I truly don’t know how to make it better. I don’t know if there’s anything to make better, or if I’ve really nailed it and it’s good to go.
And so having critique partners that can take a look at it and let me know their opinions is really helpful because that’s how I’m getting reader opinions, because it’s—it can be really difficult especially when you’re starting out, to know if your book is ‘quote unquote’ good, to know if you’ve done everything that you can do, or if there’s, you know, things that you’re missing that you could be fixing in the book. And that’s why it’s so helpful to have other people reading. I definitely recommend getting, you know, critique partners, if you can, who are in the community and who read widely and who read in the genre and the age category that you’re producing your books in.
I think it can be really difficult you know if you give the book to a family member and you’re—say you’re writing young adult fantasy and all they read is nonfiction war books—they might not necessarily be able to help you in the same way. They will certainly have a great opinion and they’ll be valuable, but in your certain genre, in your age category, there are also certain tropes and certain things that readers bring to the table when they pick up that book that make a difference in how you might write it.
I think about this, especially with fantasy there are certain things that fantasy fans are expecting and they’re able to suspend disbelief in some areas, and in some areas they’re not. And so example for high fantasy, they want you to explain how the magic works, you need to find a way to explain that to readers, whereas like a reader that maybe reads, you know, thrillers, for example, might be like, I don’t want to know how that works. I just want to get to the good bits. And so there’s a lot of benefit in getting critique partners whose reading habits are relevant to what you’re writing and getting that feedback from them.
And I think those are the huge things when you’re a newer writer, because I definitely know that my books would have not gotten to the levels that they got to without having those people, and that feedback that really helped me be guided in the right direction.
Rebecca King: And that speaks to what we read ourselves as well, I guess. You know, read widely in whatever genre you’re hoping to write in, to understand those tropes. Because yeah whenever you write down to kids, you think, “well you know, I have kids, I should be able to write a story for a kid,” but that’s not necessarily the case. And I think that’s, to your point, it’s important to have that knowledge of the specific categories and genres that you’re looking to target.
And so, can a writer, expect their agent to help them polish?
Liselle Sambury: It really depends—it’s your agent’s job to help you sell your book, and so they are going to give you some degree of feedback. I think it’s just the difference in the levels of the degree of feedback. Some agents are what we would call editorial, and so they’re very hands-on; they will help you do a lot of revisions.
My agent—excuse me—my agent, Kristy Hunter at the Knight Agency, is an editorial agent and so she helped me revise a lot. One of those sessions in which I rewrote half the book was with her revisions. I think we did about five rounds of revisions on Blood Like Magic before it went on submission. So, they were very in-depth revisions and they were super, super helpful for me. Especially because when I was querying, some of the feedback I had been getting back was that something about the structure seemed off to them. And when I had signed with Kristy she said, “You have no subplots,” and I was like, “Ah, that’s the structure thing.”
And so some agents will take you on, and they’ll be willing to go through those revisions with you and help you with things like that, those structural edits, and in some cases an agent kind of wants you to come with that kind of already figured out and they’re helping you with fixes that perhaps don’t require that level of editing and revising.
So it really depends on different agents; for me, because—especially because—I was newer, and this was going to be my first agent, I really did want to find someone editorial because I really felt like I needed the support and revisions in that case, and I really wanted to find an agent that did that. In some cases, people come with very polished work from their own revisions and they don’t need that level of support, and so they’re okay with having an agent that is perhaps less editorial. I feel like all agents have different strengths and areas and things that really work for them. And it’s really dependent on the agent, for sure.
Rebecca King: Was there anything—not to catch you off guard, but was there anything like in the call or in your research that made you go yes, this agent or this group of agents are the ones that are bringing the skill set that I want? Does it say on their website, “Yep, I’m an editorial agent”?
Liselle Sambury: It’s a bit of a mix. So, on Kristy’s agency profile—or was it on her agency profile? Let me pause, and rethink this. So it’s a bit of two things. So in my case with Kristy I had a friend, and that was, we have the same agent. And so because that friend had that experience, I already knew that okay they had a good experience with her. They had sold their books so she’s selling books, and then also on the call with Kristy she had given some background information about her background in publishing and that sort of thing. And it had come up that she had been an editorial assistant at one of the big five publishing houses. And so for me that clicked in that she had a strong editorial background.
I believe I also asked if she was like an editorial agent because that was something I was asking in calls—I had two calls just to kind of get a feel for that. And so that’s how I knew, and you can look that up in bios as well. Because I’m not sure, I believe it was also in her bio but I can’t remember for sure, but those are the sorts of things that you can do.
So, in part, like, contacting, looking, researching other clients—because you don’t necessarily want to contact other clients. If you’re friendly with them and you know them, then it’s probably comfortable for you to be like, “hey is your agent an editorial agent would you say or not? That sort of thing.” But you can also find it in their online bios.
Rebecca King: Excellent. So now, going back to the critique partners. And because it seems like in talking to people that they can either be the greatest gift, or they can be quite a danger to people, either their morale or just kind of put them down the wrong path. Can you give us just insight and guidance around how to know, how did you go about getting your critique partners, how do you know when they’re on target and you should kind of follow that path, and where the boundaries are that you say, “that kind of falls outside of the changes that I want to make.” Any thoughts on that?
Liselle Sambury: Yes! So critique partners are so valuable, beta readers as well, they’re so super helpful for the process. But I understand because I’m not gonna pretend that people don’t have bad experiences sometimes, that people get frankly mean comments.
I had an early critique partner who I was like, this might just be a mean person. Sometimes that happens. And I think over time I’ve developed a bit of a strategy for how I find new critique partners and betas in a way that helps protect me as well. I will say that when I’m talking about both—like I think of beta readers as readers who just read, and you’re not doing anything with their work necessarily, versus I think of critique partners as people who exchange with, so you read their book and they read your book. Just so it makes sense when I’m talking about the two of them.
But for me the process that I found helped me the most is that I would join a community, and I would interact with it and kind of get to know people and then eventually in that community I would make a call out to say hey this is what my book is about I’m looking for a critique partner or a beta reader. If you’re interested, please let me know.
And then from there, people that kind of responded and were interested, people that I recognized and who I had interacted with before I found tended to be more likely to volunteer in the first place, but then I also knew them a little bit at the very least, so they weren’t complete strangers. And then something I always do is I exchange a first chapter first. Only the first chapter. Because what you don’t want to do is send someone your whole manuscript, and then find out after they’ve read the whole thing that they’re mean or their comments aren’t helpful, or maybe even that they just didn’t like the book and so their comments weren’t that useful to you because they were kind of not that happy to be reading it the whole way through. And in a critique partner situation it’s also a benefit for you, in case you don’t like their book, or you don’t think it’s the right fit for you. And I think it’s all very subjective.
I don’t think you should get sad if someone’s like, “I don’t think this is a good fit,” because sometimes it really isn’t and you want someone who has interest in your book to be beta reading or critique partnering for you, because they’re going to give you the best reader feedback. And so that’s what I’ll do, I’ll exchange the first chapter and see how our notes line up. If I find that their notes aren’t super helpful to me or again if they’re mean, or if they’re sort of strangely surface level—so for example, if I’m saying I’m looking for edits about my characters and then they just want to talk about my grammar, which I don’t care about—then that’s not someone that I want to continue on with exchanging an entire book because that’s a long commitment.
And so, to me that’s kind of the safety thing that I have in place, is that I just do that small exchange to begin with, to see how you deal with the person. And it can help you with a lot of other things as well, like for example if you say, we’re going to get back to each other two weeks from now, and they don’t respond to you for four weeks, then you know that’s probably not a good partner for you because they can’t keep up with the time constraints that you’ve set with each other. And so all these things are kind of, in a way, to protect yourself as best as you can, for sure. And so after you do that if things go well then you can exchange the full manuscript from that point.
I will say that this doesn’t address, the fear that I find in a lot of writers, especially newer writers, that their ideas or their work will be stolen. And to that I’ve always been of the opinion that only you can write your story. So even if someone steals your idea they’re never going to write it in the same way that you are going to write it. And I think it’s really good to lead with that in confidence because it does happen sometimes, people do steal work, I won’t pretend that that never happens. But I don’t know that it’s as prevalent as it feels when you are coming into the community and you’re so worried about your book.
And I think, in comparison of like having that fear hold you back from ever having critique partners or beta readers is going to be a lot more detrimental to you, because I think those beta readers, those critique partners are super huge and really helpful, especially speaking from a financial point of view: if you’re not in a position to, say, hire a professional editor to have them do it for you. Those critique partners are super invaluable because that is a free service, you are exchanging books, or they are just really devoted in beta readers and they want to read it. And so I think throughout my writing career and the many beta readers and CPs I’ve had, it’s really made such a huge difference on my writing and I don’t think I would be where I am now if I had chosen not to send it out to anyone.
Rebecca King: Can you give us a sense of how many critique partners and/or beta readers is the right number?
Liselle Sambury: So for me, I like three. I like three, because five seems like a lot of feedback to get. And I like having an odd number, because if two of them comment on something and the other one doesn’t, then I’ll still address it. But if only one of them comments on something and I don’t quite agree with it, and the other two don’t even mention it, then I’ll just disregard that feedback, essentially.
And so I like having the odd number because it helps me kind of pick and choose what to pay attention to because you might not agree with all feedback, but I know myself and I know sometimes I can get emotional and I might right away be like, “I don’t agree with that.” But if I think about it a bit more, especially if two or three mentioned it, then I can think of a way that I can address that in a way that works for me. And so I like having that number. And yeah I just find that any more than three is a lot of feedback.
I once had five and it was horrible and I regretted it. It’s just a lot of feedback to have, and then also for me it’s kind of it’s a lot easier to cultivate a smaller group of CPs or beta readers, than it is to cultivate a larger group. I know some people have critique groups that are filled with like 10 or 15 people or something like that and they all read each other’s books. I just find that very stressful and I like to keep a smaller group so for me, three is really good. I think ideally you definitely want more than one, if you can, but I do know some people that are successful with having only one or two critique partners.
Rebecca King: Maybe you find the right one, that perfect one for that category. And so, what are your thoughts about the online communities? I know now, obviously we have to rely more on our online interactions, but the online critique communities like Scribophile, things like that where you’re putting your, right, your work out in the open. Any thoughts on that? Have you ever tried them?
Liselle Sambury: I’m of kind of a two minds with them. I really like those forums when you’re starting out, so when I started out I was on AgentQuery Connect. And so that’s one of those communities that was really helpful in that I could post my query letter—for example the Blood Like Magic query letter I posted there. I got lots of feedback, and that was super helpful for me because I could get a ton of feedback all at once. I found my first critique partners on there as well. And so it was really helpful in that way, but I also think sometimes they’re a bit of a double-edged sword because anyone can jump on. So there were some, you know, I would call them I guess “critique bullies” who kind of don’t know how to give critique in a constructive way. And they kind of come on and will tell people “this is bad” or “this will never sell” or “there’s no way you can query this” and they’ll come in and say things like that that, especially when you’re starting out, can be really heartbreaking and discouraging.
And so what I really like to do is to stick to kind of smaller focused communities. If people use Facebook, things like the 88 Cups of Tea podcast community is great; when Pitch Wars happens, they’ll have like a Facebook group and that community is really good. And because it’s smaller and people are more likely to know each other I find that people don’t tend to be mean, versus on forums, it’s a lot easier to be anonymous, than it is on Facebook I find.
And so I also like when it’s a smaller group, because it’s a little bit easier to get to know people—you can like see their previous posts and that sort of thing, and people that are interacting in the community, and get a much better read on them, especially for CPs and betas, than I find that you can in a forum where sometimes people don’t necessarily post at all until they’re asking for a critique partner so it’s hard to get to know people beforehand.
Rebecca King: That’s a really good point I hadn’t thought about. Yep, with Facebook you know exactly who that person is. There’s a lot more accountability there. And, and we are dangerously close on time, but I do want to get one more question in just because you’ve got so much good stuff here. And are there tricks of the trade to make revision less daunting, or is there a process you follow? Books, craft books, what is your guidance there for people that are like, ”I gotta figure out a way to do this,” what are your thoughts?
Liselle Sambury: Mm hmm. So, when I start my revision process, the first thing I’ll do is I try and let the book rest if I can. I try and do at minimum two weeks, I really work hard on doing a month away from the book, just because it gives you new perspective. I find that, at least for me, I’m very sentimental with my books—like it’s become my baby and I’m very precious with it. And when I have a month away I can kind of separate myself from it and not be so precious and sentimental.
And then what I’ll do is I’ll go through and I’ll read the whole thing, and I’ll make notes. So, I’ll make notes, if I’m like this chapter seems kind of awkward, or I’m not really sure that what the character is doing is making sense in this chapter, and I’ll go through and I’ll do that for the whole manuscript and I won’t touch anything to edit. I’m not allowed to edit it, I’m just there to read and make notes, because when you start editing I find you get into a different brain mode, and you’re doing something different now when you’re really meant to be kind of evaluating it, at least for me, in that part.
And then once I’ve gone through, I’ve done all the evaluating, I’ve made all my notes, I try and think about things that I’m not sure how to fix, because sometimes I don’t know how to fix something. Sometimes I’ll just write “the romance seems weird question mark.” And that’s the only note I have for myself, because I haven’t figured out how to fix it.
And at that point there are kind of several things I can do: sometimes I’ll reach back out to my critique partners or beta readers and ask them what they thought of something specific. So if I think the romance is weird, I’ll ask them “what did you think of the romance,” open-ended so that I’m not leading them. I won’t say “is the romance weird” because it kind of narrows it down to them, versus if I ask open-ended “what did you think about it,” sometimes I think something is weird and my critique partners will say, “Oh, I really love that” or “I didn’t,” or “I thought that was great”, versus if I asked them if it was weird they’d probably try really hard to think of whether they noticed anything weird versus a more open-ended question and so that’ll be a big thing.
I’ll brainstorm with my critique partners, which to me is a huge part of being friendly with your critique partners and knowing them, because then you have that resource that you can talk to them about your books and your ideas and struggles that you’re having versus the kind of one-off person that you found.
And then after that point, I will try and find writing craft books. So I did have a moment where I was like “this romance is weird” and I picked up Romancing the Beats by Gwen Hayes, to help me out. And that was really helpful and that jogged a lot of ideas. Sometimes, I will go on YouTube and I’ll just kind of look up a topic and see if anyone has videos about it.
So essentially getting into research mode to try and answer all these questions that I asked myself, and then at that point, I can structure out how I’m going to do a revision, which I think is different for everyone. I like to organize my stuff by chapter because it’s just easier for me. And then I really try and create manageable chunks for getting things done. Because if I just sit down and think I’ve got to revise this entire book, it’s so daunting and completely painful. And so what I’ll do is I’ll be like, I’m going to revise two chapters a day, or one or two chapters a day and I’ll plan it out and I’ll make a little schedule for myself, so that I can focus on just doing small amounts over time. I find that’s especially useful once you have things like deadlines because then you have times where you have to get things done. And it’s a lot easier to have those manageable chunks.
Rebecca King: Yeah, I can’t even imagine. Trying to write a book, learning the process is hard, and then when you’re on the other side, okay, now I’ve sold one and now there are deadlines around it, but it seems like it takes an enormous skill set. So hats off to you for sure. And, unfortunately, we’re definitely out of time. I want to thank you for your guidance and you have some great stuff online so before we go definitely let the listeners know how can they reach out to you—or you have some things on YouTube, right? Some videos and things to give additional guidance?
Liselle Sambury: Yes, so I have a YouTube AuthorTube channel where I talk all about my experiences being a traditionally published author and some things about my journey and some advice videos as well. And some interviews that I do with other authors to talk about different topics as well, so you can definitely find me there. All under my name, Liselle Sambury, same with my Twitter and my Instagram, and my website is LiselleSambury.ca because I am proudly Canadian so I wanted a dot ca. And yeah, otherwise everything’s under my name.
Rebecca King: Excellent . Do check out her YouTube channel, lots of stuff there for everyone listening to WriteOnCon 2021, thank you so much for joining us. If you’d like to take part in the discussion, we’d love for you to do so in the comments on this podcast page. Do remember there is also a critique partner section as part of WriteOnCon. So you can post your information up and look at other people that have posted their information up to see if you can find yourself a few critique partners there. Enjoy the rest of the conference and happy writing.